DJTroy
I thought that is what the CDJA was for. Tammy, out on the front lines, representing, fighting for our rights and the rights of the future generations of DJs!
He He He
-I would like to see some better information. What they can do, what they can't do, Hard data on prosecutions, and the ammount of tax payers dollars spent (aka RCMP) in these matters. Are they (AVLA) making any difference? or are they just using bully (scare) tactics to leach a ride on the music band wagon. Exactly how many have they actuall nailed, and what were the end penelties? How about selective persecuton issues (ie: uniformity of enforcement)?
I might get behind a NFP SIG (Not For Profit, Special Interest Group) that addressed the above...
We could call it:
"Canadian Allegiance for Truth And Sincere Sound" (The national Association)
"Regional Allegiance for Truth And Sincere Sound" (Local chapters)
I did not know if I should mention this, but: Last night I was visited by the ghost of Johnnie Cochran three times. The first time he told me that "we" should fight for the rights of DJs Everywhare! The second time, he assured me that Chewbacca will help us in our fight! And the final time, he reminded me to brush my teeth before every gig.
He He He - I just love Saturday morning breakfast.
TP
He He He
-I would like to see some better information. What they can do, what they can't do, Hard data on prosecutions, and the ammount of tax payers dollars spent (aka RCMP) in these matters. Are they (AVLA) making any difference? or are they just using bully (scare) tactics to leach a ride on the music band wagon. Exactly how many have they actuall nailed, and what were the end penelties? How about selective persecuton issues (ie: uniformity of enforcement)?
I might get behind a NFP SIG (Not For Profit, Special Interest Group) that addressed the above...
We could call it:
"Canadian Allegiance for Truth And Sincere Sound" (The national Association)
"Regional Allegiance for Truth And Sincere Sound" (Local chapters)
I did not know if I should mention this, but: Last night I was visited by the ghost of Johnnie Cochran three times. The first time he told me that "we" should fight for the rights of DJs Everywhare! The second time, he assured me that Chewbacca will help us in our fight! And the final time, he reminded me to brush my teeth before every gig.
He He He - I just love Saturday morning breakfast.
TP
geposted Sat 30 Sep 06 @ 4:27 pm
DJTroy
geposted Sat 30 Sep 06 @ 5:14 pm
sirslick
I totally agree that we virtual DJs should be legit and that means getting a license which gives us the freedom and protection to play anything on our hard drive.
I live in Toronto and there is a Canadian association called CODJA - Canadian Online Disc Jockey's Association.
Annnual membership in CODJA includes lots of perks (training, education, show discounts, networking etc) but also an AVLA hard drive license.
And, membership fees for most professional associations are tax deductible too!
Check them out at the link below.
J
www.codja.com
I live in Toronto and there is a Canadian association called CODJA - Canadian Online Disc Jockey's Association.
Annnual membership in CODJA includes lots of perks (training, education, show discounts, networking etc) but also an AVLA hard drive license.
And, membership fees for most professional associations are tax deductible too!
Check them out at the link below.
J
www.codja.com
geposted Tue 03 Oct 06 @ 7:24 pm
DJTroy
Thanx, that (CODJA) will save me some $$.
I am still curious about statistics. It would be an interesting paper to research.
TP
I am still curious about statistics. It would be an interesting paper to research.
TP
geposted Tue 03 Oct 06 @ 7:52 pm
Raw-Bear
So thats what it's called now...CODJA...I remember it as CDJA...no on-line
keep the beat sweet
keep the beat sweet
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 1:10 am
DJTroy
Last I herd, CDJA was (still) being run by Tammy (president) -she can be reached at Ryhthm Rob's DJ Svc in Hamilton, Ontario. CODJA is run by Dennis Hampson. Back in the 80's he was (I think) the president of CDJA. That is when we were members (T'N'T Productions).
Unfortunately, we never got the stickers that we were suppose to put on our cassettes. We never got the 'free' membership for forming a new chapter either (Owen Sound). So, I made up my own stickers (on the computer "This cassette is AVLA licensed via CDJA"). And never renewed my membership.
FYI: Last time that I checked, Tamy is also the owner of Multi Music Service. (formerly Vancouver?)
As a matter of fact:
Or it is simply not in their best interest...
TP
Unfortunately, we never got the stickers that we were suppose to put on our cassettes. We never got the 'free' membership for forming a new chapter either (Owen Sound). So, I made up my own stickers (on the computer "This cassette is AVLA licensed via CDJA"). And never renewed my membership.
FYI: Last time that I checked, Tamy is also the owner of Multi Music Service. (formerly Vancouver?)
DJTroy wrote :
I thought that is what the CDJA was for. Tammy, out on the front lines, representing, fighting for our rights and the rights of the future generations of DJs!
As a matter of fact:
DJTroy wrote :
I have been (unofficially) warned that DJing from my PC is ILLEGAL in Canada, and that I should expect my EQUIPMENT to be SEIZED by the A.V.L.A. (Audio Visual Licensing Agency - http://www.avla.ca/ ). Apparently copying music to the hard drive is the issue (piracy)...
...I was also told not even to mention the fact that the software has built in broadcast ability or my entire music collection will be seized.
The sources are ABSOLUTELY reliable. I will not identify them because i do not want to admit that i was warned.
My understanding is that the CDJA Canadian Disk Jockey Association ( http://www.cdja.org/ ) does not have the legal resources to fight the AVLA.
...I was also told not even to mention the fact that the software has built in broadcast ability or my entire music collection will be seized.
The sources are ABSOLUTELY reliable. I will not identify them because i do not want to admit that i was warned.
My understanding is that the CDJA Canadian Disk Jockey Association ( http://www.cdja.org/ ) does not have the legal resources to fight the AVLA.
Or it is simply not in their best interest...
TP
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 2:25 am
DJTroy
I really think that we need CATASS. Dibs on the Toronto chapter of RATASS.
I also think that we need jackets and slip-mats. Anyone want to make a logo?
TP
(Boy, do I ever need a gig BAD!)
I also think that we need jackets and slip-mats. Anyone want to make a logo?
TP
(Boy, do I ever need a gig BAD!)
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 4:40 am
Raw-Bear
Send your logo ideas to robert@applied-designs.com
Thats one of the things we do and we do it VERY well. We have an international client base and it would be great to draw something up for the Canadian DJs out there. We also produce labels and cards and I (the owner) would be more than happy to give a deal to some fellow DJs out there.
THIS IS A FLAGRANT ADVERTISEMENT FOR SURE IT IS !!
In future I will try to........
Keep the beat sweet..
Thats one of the things we do and we do it VERY well. We have an international client base and it would be great to draw something up for the Canadian DJs out there. We also produce labels and cards and I (the owner) would be more than happy to give a deal to some fellow DJs out there.
THIS IS A FLAGRANT ADVERTISEMENT FOR SURE IT IS !!
In future I will try to........
Keep the beat sweet..
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 5:12 pm
DJTroy
Yes, I want to start working on an "unbias" project.
Attention Canadian Djs: Know your Rights AND Responsibilities!
Its time to cut out some of this flagrent BULL SHIT! I was on a Edmonton DJ page who claimed that PC DJs were unreliable due to the possability of a VIRUS INFECTION! -LMAO "that desperate for work, eh?"
Then again, this same site offered: a lowest price guarantee! yet presented a selling argument in favour of hi-priced services, directly attacking low priced DJs. -LMAO
Whatever hapened to the day when a man's work spoke for him. (or her)
TP
Attention Canadian Djs: Know your Rights AND Responsibilities!
Its time to cut out some of this flagrent BULL SHIT! I was on a Edmonton DJ page who claimed that PC DJs were unreliable due to the possability of a VIRUS INFECTION! -LMAO "that desperate for work, eh?"
Then again, this same site offered: a lowest price guarantee! yet presented a selling argument in favour of hi-priced services, directly attacking low priced DJs. -LMAO
Whatever hapened to the day when a man's work spoke for him. (or her)
TP
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 5:58 pm
Raw-Bear
Well, you have my e-mail address DJ Troy. The ball is now in your court. We are not too far apart, no more than 45 minutes so getting together should not be a problem. Looking forward to hearing from you.
Keep the beat sweet.
Keep the beat sweet.
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 9:52 pm
Supacon
Marcel, I'm also in Edmonton... I DJ at the Globe, and you can add me to that list.
I'm very interested in such legal issues.
To be honest, I don't own originals of 100% of my music (who does),
On the other hand, I do own almost every series of ERG CD (I'm estimating >1,000 discs), and about 300 promo only CDs, as well as all of the Promo DVDs made available in Canada, with a couple exceptions of DVDs that were no longer available.
The irony is that it doesn't matter... the AVLA license and whatever other bullshit laws don't allow me to copy these onto my computer, technically.
I do own perhaps 1,000 regular CDs that you'd buy from a store, on the other hand... and I've downloaded some of my stuff, especially rare or hard to find albums... is this supposed to be legal in Canada, as I've heard? What about for commercial use? I'm afraid that I simply cannot afford to buy every CD that comes out though... I already spend over $170 per month between my CD and DVD subscriptions, and maybe another $50 per month on CDs. So basically I have to work for one night a month for free to pay for my new music, which I can't technically use anyways.
At this point I'm not licensed... the license seems kinda silly and pointless to me. I guess you need one for each hard drive, and technically my rig has three hard drives. If you run an array (like a 4 disk raid 5) do you need 1 license or 4? 4 would be silly... But does this license allow you to download music off the internet? Copy CDs from friends? If not, then what the hell is the point, since you've gotta pay for copies of your music anyways?
Anyways, I'm all for anything that makes this stuff simpler and less complicated for everyone.
I'm very interested in such legal issues.
To be honest, I don't own originals of 100% of my music (who does),
On the other hand, I do own almost every series of ERG CD (I'm estimating >1,000 discs), and about 300 promo only CDs, as well as all of the Promo DVDs made available in Canada, with a couple exceptions of DVDs that were no longer available.
The irony is that it doesn't matter... the AVLA license and whatever other bullshit laws don't allow me to copy these onto my computer, technically.
I do own perhaps 1,000 regular CDs that you'd buy from a store, on the other hand... and I've downloaded some of my stuff, especially rare or hard to find albums... is this supposed to be legal in Canada, as I've heard? What about for commercial use? I'm afraid that I simply cannot afford to buy every CD that comes out though... I already spend over $170 per month between my CD and DVD subscriptions, and maybe another $50 per month on CDs. So basically I have to work for one night a month for free to pay for my new music, which I can't technically use anyways.
At this point I'm not licensed... the license seems kinda silly and pointless to me. I guess you need one for each hard drive, and technically my rig has three hard drives. If you run an array (like a 4 disk raid 5) do you need 1 license or 4? 4 would be silly... But does this license allow you to download music off the internet? Copy CDs from friends? If not, then what the hell is the point, since you've gotta pay for copies of your music anyways?
Anyways, I'm all for anything that makes this stuff simpler and less complicated for everyone.
geposted Wed 04 Oct 06 @ 10:13 pm
DJTroy
Back in the 70's (?) Musicians went through a similar battle. Some agency tried to stop bar bands from playing covers. (Cover) bands formed an alliance and dealt with the record companies directly. They mutualy agreed that: cover bands promote signed acts, and therefore sell records. (SOCAN?)
My firend (MI player - National concert promoter) suggested that we (Djs) should get together and put an end to this AVLA madness. And that we should directly approach the record companies to express our concerns. -that no matter what license we have, we are breaking one law or annother and video just makes the situation worse. Our rigs and our businesses are in jeapordy.
TP
My firend (MI player - National concert promoter) suggested that we (Djs) should get together and put an end to this AVLA madness. And that we should directly approach the record companies to express our concerns. -that no matter what license we have, we are breaking one law or annother and video just makes the situation worse. Our rigs and our businesses are in jeapordy.
TP
geposted Wed 25 Oct 06 @ 3:15 pm
DJTroy
We could get together at my Oakville Club. Easy highway assess, privacy, and TCV... And a good buffet ;) The venue is Family Friendly.
If we do this we should do some research before hand, so we do more than just complain. Perhaps bring in a guestspeaker (depending on mumbers). -I know that Raw Bear wants to come.
I suggest Sunday Novermer 5, 2006 @ 1:00 pm. This will be the 'founders' meeting.
Super Buffet
384 Iroquois Shore Rd
Oakville, ON
Map to Super Buffet
RSVP (send me your e-mail, and I will send you my cell #)
TP
If we do this we should do some research before hand, so we do more than just complain. Perhaps bring in a guestspeaker (depending on mumbers). -I know that Raw Bear wants to come.
I suggest Sunday Novermer 5, 2006 @ 1:00 pm. This will be the 'founders' meeting.
Super Buffet
384 Iroquois Shore Rd
Oakville, ON
Map to Super Buffet
RSVP (send me your e-mail, and I will send you my cell #)
TP
geposted Wed 25 Oct 06 @ 3:41 pm
Raw-Bear
Well, you can count me in. Both DJTroy and myself have stepped up to the plate and offered both of our places of business to meet. My store would be more private but, it would not have the food. Therefore I for one will be more than happy to go where there is food. FOOOOOOOOD....yes....Thats a deal I can live (and eat) with.
There are enough VDJs and Atomix users here in Southern Ontario to at least get a grass roots thing going. Even if a member lives in another province or state it matters not in this day and age of the internet. EVERYONE could attend via a video feed I think. All members would have a vote and maybe we could put to bed some of these STUPID laws that we all live in fear of.
I could never understand how playing someones music for money was wrong. After all, someone might hear a song and go and buy the CD. Every time we play a tune are we not promoting that artist?
DJTroy, you can count me in if you get a big enough response.
Regardless, you and I and DanceFactor are going to meet one day soon.
By forming a group of this type we will be able to......
Keep the beat sweet.
There are enough VDJs and Atomix users here in Southern Ontario to at least get a grass roots thing going. Even if a member lives in another province or state it matters not in this day and age of the internet. EVERYONE could attend via a video feed I think. All members would have a vote and maybe we could put to bed some of these STUPID laws that we all live in fear of.
I could never understand how playing someones music for money was wrong. After all, someone might hear a song and go and buy the CD. Every time we play a tune are we not promoting that artist?
DJTroy, you can count me in if you get a big enough response.
Regardless, you and I and DanceFactor are going to meet one day soon.
By forming a group of this type we will be able to......
Keep the beat sweet.
geposted Wed 25 Oct 06 @ 5:17 pm
bigdaddy1969blue
Hey All,
Troy it was a slice talkin' to you today.
I'm in Edmonton, one thing is for sure there's a lot of misconception about the AVLA and what DJs can or cannot do. We found that out when we had to deal with Dennis Hampson. We actually fell for his rhetoric/fear mongering over just how powerful the AVLA was and how the CDJA could save us all from Damnation- at least that's what it felt like.
There are WAY more than a handfull of people in Canada that are willing to band together and make changes on their own. Rolling out in just a week and a half is a new Canadian on-line service for DJs and Club Owners to buy AVLA and insurance legally with the straight goods. This is no BS, I'm involved with the developement and roll-out.
The CDJA may not have the money to litigate with AVLA. But the AVLA doesn't have money to litigate with ANYONE. They would rather see compliance than litigation. With that said, the ALVA has also informed us that ANYONE in the process of investigating a DJ (even on a random drop-in) should produce ID and even an AVLA card.
The AVLA WILL NOT SHUT DOWN YOUR EVENT even if you are in violation of the law. Their investigator will get information from you and report back to the AVLA. The AVLA will contact you; standard cease and decist crap and maybe some advise on how to get compliant.
The AVLA does NOT require you to OWN the original source- you must be able to indicate WHERE you got it from: library, friend or even your best friend's mom. As long as your copy came from AN ORIGINAL.
The AVLA does not allow for downloaded music (except from Promo Only's PODDs) simply because SOCAN has not determined a mill rate for on-line distribution of musical works (yeah, kinda sucks if you're an artist with albums selling online anywhere). Promo Only negotiated directly with the Record Lables and bypassed the AVLA altogether (hmmmm.....A sign of things to come?) to fast track this program.
The AVLA also doesn't allow us to copy our Essential Radio, knockout Hits, Power Trakks or anything else that we licensed for use. But, that doesn't seem to be what the AVLA is looking for. They are looking for those cheap little Avery stickers at our gigs. I was inspected a few years ago by the AVLA. Guy came in and gave me a AVLA card and asked if I was using burned CDs. Of course I was. He didn't even look at them or counted to see how many I had. He only asked if I had an AVLA license. I showed it to him and he left. Piece of cake.
AVLA is listening, though. We've asked them to consider a "combo" license; a permit for both CD and HD libraries carried by one user. That appears to be coming soon. We have continually asked for a reprieve from the issue of copying the AVLA licensed libraries from ERG, MMS and Promo Only. At least to consider an on-line license for this. Thier ears are still pretty waxy- if you know what I mean.
If anyone wants to be notified of the official roll-out of our "alliance" I'll leave my email info@cityprodj.com and phone number 1-877-944-2776 . I'd love to hear from everyone!
Kev
Troy it was a slice talkin' to you today.
I'm in Edmonton, one thing is for sure there's a lot of misconception about the AVLA and what DJs can or cannot do. We found that out when we had to deal with Dennis Hampson. We actually fell for his rhetoric/fear mongering over just how powerful the AVLA was and how the CDJA could save us all from Damnation- at least that's what it felt like.
There are WAY more than a handfull of people in Canada that are willing to band together and make changes on their own. Rolling out in just a week and a half is a new Canadian on-line service for DJs and Club Owners to buy AVLA and insurance legally with the straight goods. This is no BS, I'm involved with the developement and roll-out.
The CDJA may not have the money to litigate with AVLA. But the AVLA doesn't have money to litigate with ANYONE. They would rather see compliance than litigation. With that said, the ALVA has also informed us that ANYONE in the process of investigating a DJ (even on a random drop-in) should produce ID and even an AVLA card.
The AVLA WILL NOT SHUT DOWN YOUR EVENT even if you are in violation of the law. Their investigator will get information from you and report back to the AVLA. The AVLA will contact you; standard cease and decist crap and maybe some advise on how to get compliant.
The AVLA does NOT require you to OWN the original source- you must be able to indicate WHERE you got it from: library, friend or even your best friend's mom. As long as your copy came from AN ORIGINAL.
The AVLA does not allow for downloaded music (except from Promo Only's PODDs) simply because SOCAN has not determined a mill rate for on-line distribution of musical works (yeah, kinda sucks if you're an artist with albums selling online anywhere). Promo Only negotiated directly with the Record Lables and bypassed the AVLA altogether (hmmmm.....A sign of things to come?) to fast track this program.
The AVLA also doesn't allow us to copy our Essential Radio, knockout Hits, Power Trakks or anything else that we licensed for use. But, that doesn't seem to be what the AVLA is looking for. They are looking for those cheap little Avery stickers at our gigs. I was inspected a few years ago by the AVLA. Guy came in and gave me a AVLA card and asked if I was using burned CDs. Of course I was. He didn't even look at them or counted to see how many I had. He only asked if I had an AVLA license. I showed it to him and he left. Piece of cake.
AVLA is listening, though. We've asked them to consider a "combo" license; a permit for both CD and HD libraries carried by one user. That appears to be coming soon. We have continually asked for a reprieve from the issue of copying the AVLA licensed libraries from ERG, MMS and Promo Only. At least to consider an on-line license for this. Thier ears are still pretty waxy- if you know what I mean.
If anyone wants to be notified of the official roll-out of our "alliance" I'll leave my email info@cityprodj.com and phone number 1-877-944-2776 . I'd love to hear from everyone!
Kev
geposted Wed 25 Oct 06 @ 11:55 pm
Soundman69
Hey Kev,
Thanks for all the terrific info. I was aware of most of this already and had maintained, just as you said, if you have any form of AVLA license when you are spot checked you will be fine. They are just after our hard earned dollars despite the fact that we are promoting their music for the most part. Also, as you said, and I have maintained also, the AVLA is relatively powerless. The reason they won't shut down your event is because they have no legal right to do so. I'd love to hear when the rollout occurs. I'll shoot you an email. I'd imagine it will get posted here as well. Since AVLA goes by calendar year only (ridiculous), it makes no sense to get one until January anyway.
Thanks for all the terrific info. I was aware of most of this already and had maintained, just as you said, if you have any form of AVLA license when you are spot checked you will be fine. They are just after our hard earned dollars despite the fact that we are promoting their music for the most part. Also, as you said, and I have maintained also, the AVLA is relatively powerless. The reason they won't shut down your event is because they have no legal right to do so. I'd love to hear when the rollout occurs. I'll shoot you an email. I'd imagine it will get posted here as well. Since AVLA goes by calendar year only (ridiculous), it makes no sense to get one until January anyway.
geposted Thu 26 Oct 06 @ 12:11 am
DJTroy
So I guess that the concerns that I have, are:
My Suggestion
As things stand: Almost any Canadian DJ or KJ who is using a PC based system (reading files from HD) is breaking 'the law'; Video and Karaoke cannot legally be copied to HD. Period. Compilations cannot be copied to HD. I suggest that there is a difference between 'copying' music and 'adjusting its format'. If the industry were to recognize this, then most of these issues would go away. I am concerned that because of the holes in the law, selective targeted prosecution is possible. I am not happy (content) with "They probably won't bug you, you are not who they are after".
PS: It was a great meeting Sunday. He He He...
- Most 'Pro' (Top 50) Djs use a compilation service to form the base of their music collection; This is not covered by the AVLA license.
Video - AVLA DJ License does not cover music video.
- Video's purchased in a record store are "For Home Use Only" (a similar example is purchasing the new X-Men movie and playing it commercially)-This issue is a leftover from the 80's.
- PO (Promo Only) video pool is a lease service therefore we cannot copy it.
Karaoke - AVLA does not cover Karaoke.
- There are too many different producers of Karaoke to get everyone together under one umbrella.
Conflicts of Interest - I am concerned that those who 'represent DJs' may not be working in the best interest of DJs.
Effects on my Customer - Imagine this: The RCMP enter the bar where you work to exercise a warrant based on the DJs illegal copying of music videos. All computer systems and digital storage medium in the venue are seized as a part of the investigation.
- Not that 'this' is any of my business, but let's be real about where we (sometimes) work.
- Do you want to be the one handing the RCMP (aka: Feds) a search and seizure warrant for the club?
Audio
My Suggestion
As things stand: Almost any Canadian DJ or KJ who is using a PC based system (reading files from HD) is breaking 'the law'; Video and Karaoke cannot legally be copied to HD. Period. Compilations cannot be copied to HD. I suggest that there is a difference between 'copying' music and 'adjusting its format'. If the industry were to recognize this, then most of these issues would go away. I am concerned that because of the holes in the law, selective targeted prosecution is possible. I am not happy (content) with "They probably won't bug you, you are not who they are after".
PS: It was a great meeting Sunday. He He He...
geposted Mon 06 Nov 06 @ 2:29 pm
DJTroy
And One More..
The broadcast server in VDJ opens doors to the world stage, yet us Canadians cannot legally use it. I really was breaking 'the law' when I used my MMS content on my college radio show... Yet new bands were getting promoted...
DJTroy
- If I am contracted to work with a radio station and we decide to do a 'live-to-air'... Why are none of my compilations licensed for broadcast. Only pros use compilation services...
- What if I want to broadcast 'live karaoke' or 'live to air' on my web site? (This is a seller.)
- What if I want to broadcast some ones wedding (and/or reception) on the net for relatives who could not attend?
- What if I am broadcasting video? (web site's web cam vs video feed eg: Pre show and intermission music on an internationally broadcast rock concert -AC/DC or intermission and break music (videos) for the local cable tv station who is broadcasting the local Hockey Game...)
Broadcast Issues
The broadcast server in VDJ opens doors to the world stage, yet us Canadians cannot legally use it. I really was breaking 'the law' when I used my MMS content on my college radio show... Yet new bands were getting promoted...
DJTroy
geposted Mon 06 Nov 06 @ 3:24 pm
djjohan
Hi there, nice to read this kind of information and to know people from my area that are currently using the best sofware VDJ .
I live in toronto and would like to meet people that use this software so I can learn more from them If any one plays music around GTA o near from toronto I would like to visit you guys just let me know the adress of the club so I can get in touch with you guys..
DJjohan
I live in toronto and would like to meet people that use this software so I can learn more from them If any one plays music around GTA o near from toronto I would like to visit you guys just let me know the adress of the club so I can get in touch with you guys..
DJjohan
geposted Tue 07 Nov 06 @ 12:59 am
Raw-Bear
DARN !!
I forgot all about the meeting....working 18 hr days 6 days a week must be catching up with me. Troy, you have my e-mail. Drop me a line and let me know what was decided please if you can.
Kev? It was great talking to you too. Lots of info from both you and Troy.
keep the beat sweet.
I forgot all about the meeting....working 18 hr days 6 days a week must be catching up with me. Troy, you have my e-mail. Drop me a line and let me know what was decided please if you can.
Kev? It was great talking to you too. Lots of info from both you and Troy.
keep the beat sweet.
geposted Wed 08 Nov 06 @ 6:57 pm