Mobile Zombie
bigron1 wrote :
I've got all sorts of options for my Pioneer asio driver..I'd bet that if needed dropping down from 24bit to 16bit would improve stability (if needed), and the music and response would sound more or less the same. Note that the CD Red Book standard was 16bit ! Also a top of the range gaming laptop might help get the latency down below the default (Beatbreaker's need perhaps!). This could be important to those who use DVS systems.
Comments?
Comments?
In Denon ASIO driver, only buffer size can be adjusted, 512 default
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 2:54 pm
VDJ Ron
Does it tell you the latency?
..my default is 5.8msecs (44.1khz) at a buffer size of 256
At a buffer size of 512 I get a latency of 11.6msec
..my default is 5.8msecs (44.1khz) at a buffer size of 256
At a buffer size of 512 I get a latency of 11.6msec
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:03 pm
DJ Varium
If his buffer size is 512 then his latency will be 11.6ms at 44100khz
EDIT - you just edited your comment. Of course it will be.
Buffer size / sample rate = latency
EDIT - you just edited your comment. Of course it will be.
Buffer size / sample rate = latency
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:05 pm
VDJ Ron
How do you know?
Spot on..
THANK YOU!
Spot on..
THANK YOU!
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:08 pm
VDJ Ron
So..are there any audio glitches using the Denon unit at a beffer size of 256?
How important is the type of laptop being used with respect to audio glitches at lower asio buffer settings?
10msecs might be the limit at which a human can detect any lag.
How important is the type of laptop being used with respect to audio glitches at lower asio buffer settings?
10msecs might be the limit at which a human can detect any lag.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:18 pm
DJ Varium
bigron1 wrote :
How important is the type of laptop being used with respect to audio glitches at lower aaio buffer settings?
Well its entirely related, the lower the buffer size, the more computing power you need.
If you think of the buffer in mega bytes (even though its not, its a smaller byte size) then at 512 it is putting 512mb of audio in the buffer to play. windows then goes off to do other buffered tasks and hopefully gets back before that 512 has finished playing and then buffers the next 512mb. Audio drop outs and glitches are when the buffered audio finishes playing before windows can get back to it, so the lower the figure, the faster the computer has to be.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:25 pm
VDJ Ron
That makes sense..thank you again Andy!
I'd therefore conclude that it's a good idea to closely watch laptop CPU usage whilst working for many reasons (audio + video).
This is a good thread..also if the big guns come in such as Phantom and Adion there might still be much to learn.
I'd therefore conclude that it's a good idea to closely watch laptop CPU usage whilst working for many reasons (audio + video).
This is a good thread..also if the big guns come in such as Phantom and Adion there might still be much to learn.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:34 pm
VDJ Ron
Going back to the Pioneer asio settings I also have a kernel buffer set to 3 by default..whatever it does?
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:50 pm
DJ Varium
Just to add a bit to it, the reason you get less latency with a lower buffer size is that when you press something, it cant happen until that 512mb has finished playing. It cant go into the queue until after it.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 3:51 pm
nassausky
MrJackson2014 wrote :
But you feel that the Denon ASIO driver is stable ?
But you feel that the Denon ASIO driver is stable ?
I'm sorry I didn't use it enough and once again I had it hooked up for 2 days and now it's disconnected and packed away. I just did like the performance of the ASIO driver. Longest I think I had it running was like 3 hours straight. Life is so crazy that I can't get time to work with it.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 7:23 pm
kradcliffe
The Denon ASIO drivers have always been a mystery. With the HC-4500 & MC6000 I could never get them to reliably work and all my machines have been pretty high spec. Conversely the one machine they did work on was an Atom powered netbook which completely defies logic.
I would like to get the MCX8000 but apart from the size I still have issue with denon ASIO drivers as it seems they have never seemed to bottom out the issues. When I had the DDJ-SX2 I never had a single problem with the Pioneer supplied ones.
I'm happy with the MC6000 mk1 (and the spare new one tucked away) which both work perfectly with WASAPI on multiple machines.
Denon really need to get this fixed or it will hurt their reputation in the longer term.
I would like to get the MCX8000 but apart from the size I still have issue with denon ASIO drivers as it seems they have never seemed to bottom out the issues. When I had the DDJ-SX2 I never had a single problem with the Pioneer supplied ones.
I'm happy with the MC6000 mk1 (and the spare new one tucked away) which both work perfectly with WASAPI on multiple machines.
Denon really need to get this fixed or it will hurt their reputation in the longer term.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 7:35 pm
VDJ Ron
I don't remember having any problems with the mc3000 or mc6000 Denon asio drivers..hm it's a tricky life.
geposted Thu 27 Apr 17 @ 8:21 pm
VDJ Ron
I feel a little tired at the moment so I can't be sure I'm correct...
..so I'm checking out a ddj sx and play a track, I hear a faint kind of clip clop noise. I leave a track running on one deck in a loop, then turn all the volume faders down and move the crossfader to the none playing channel..yep there it is clip clop. All volume faders down, master on half vol. I check the leads..they seem ok. Still the clip clop. Check the drivers being used..wasapi. I then installed the latest Pioneer asio drivers. The faint clip clop disappeared.
I'd suggest listening very closely to your music.
I thought I was imagining the clip clop..but it was real.
Be very careful and check everything many times.
Oh and I tried two laptops using wasapi drivers and both had the faint clip clop.
At first I thought it was hardware..maybe the crossfader bleeding.
It was a coincidence that I also happened to be involved in this thread.
..so I'm checking out a ddj sx and play a track, I hear a faint kind of clip clop noise. I leave a track running on one deck in a loop, then turn all the volume faders down and move the crossfader to the none playing channel..yep there it is clip clop. All volume faders down, master on half vol. I check the leads..they seem ok. Still the clip clop. Check the drivers being used..wasapi. I then installed the latest Pioneer asio drivers. The faint clip clop disappeared.
I'd suggest listening very closely to your music.
I thought I was imagining the clip clop..but it was real.
Be very careful and check everything many times.
Oh and I tried two laptops using wasapi drivers and both had the faint clip clop.
At first I thought it was hardware..maybe the crossfader bleeding.
It was a coincidence that I also happened to be involved in this thread.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 12:20 am
Mobile Zombie
Reason for putting up this thread was not to blame the Denon ASIO driver for being unuseable.
I have had the MCX8000 for one week now, and I am investigating its potential and performance and overall I am very happy with the unit.
It offers so much exciting stuff in terms of mapping and so on.
So for now, I am learning the unit's tricks, do's and do not's, testing between ASIO and WASAPI.
Hopefully the ASIO drivers will be stable enough, as I also used the ASIO for MC6000mk1 for many years without issues, but after reading some info about how glitchy that drivers were I used the MC6000mk1 with WASAPI in the end, just for proactive reasons really.
I managed to run the MCX with WASAPI yesterday, but for some reason after a few tracks, noise starts to occour and drop out more and more, until complete silence.
Changing audio settings to ASIO drivers back on, sound will resume.
ASIO turns out to run mostly well, I had some unexplained things happen early, but that COULD be me doing things incorrect.
I am in a process right now also, checking the USB drivers on the PC, I cannot blame the MCX for anything yet.
Finally, the CPU I'm using is a i5-4690k under Windows7 64bit. According to DPC latency checker the responsetimes are very short, typically 50-80uS constantly. So performance is no issue at least.
I have had the MCX8000 for one week now, and I am investigating its potential and performance and overall I am very happy with the unit.
It offers so much exciting stuff in terms of mapping and so on.
So for now, I am learning the unit's tricks, do's and do not's, testing between ASIO and WASAPI.
Hopefully the ASIO drivers will be stable enough, as I also used the ASIO for MC6000mk1 for many years without issues, but after reading some info about how glitchy that drivers were I used the MC6000mk1 with WASAPI in the end, just for proactive reasons really.
I managed to run the MCX with WASAPI yesterday, but for some reason after a few tracks, noise starts to occour and drop out more and more, until complete silence.
Changing audio settings to ASIO drivers back on, sound will resume.
ASIO turns out to run mostly well, I had some unexplained things happen early, but that COULD be me doing things incorrect.
I am in a process right now also, checking the USB drivers on the PC, I cannot blame the MCX for anything yet.
Finally, the CPU I'm using is a i5-4690k under Windows7 64bit. According to DPC latency checker the responsetimes are very short, typically 50-80uS constantly. So performance is no issue at least.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 6:38 am
Mobile Zombie
Adion wrote :
When you select it as WASAPI (both with and without exclusiveAudioAccess), what do you see in the audio config after pressing apply exactly?
Does it fail to initialize, or does it show some numbers at the end?
Does it fail to initialize, or does it show some numbers at the end?
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 6:47 am
Adion
Looks like in exclusive mode 4 channels are available, so it should work like that.
Check if the volume in windows mixer is not down or muted perhaps.
Check if the volume in windows mixer is not down or muted perhaps.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 7:06 am
Mobile Zombie
For some reason, it now appears to work. I get 4 channels (if using exclusive on)
When setting exclusive to off, 2 channels disappear (the monitor channels)
A weird thing is that everything works fine for a few tracks, but starts to loose quality more and more. Drop outs begin and after a minute it's all silence.
Then I have to apply changes again in audio settings and it begins to work again.
For now, it's obvious that Denon ASIO works best and I will continue that way for the moment. I will still investigate the WASAPI issue in parallell as time permits.
As a sidenote:
I have always wondered if using a separate soundcard (PCI-ex, not USB) works more stable together with MIDI controllers with built-in soundcards.
Then MIDI controller only has to TX/RX MIDI data instead of both MIDI and USB audio.
When setting exclusive to off, 2 channels disappear (the monitor channels)
A weird thing is that everything works fine for a few tracks, but starts to loose quality more and more. Drop outs begin and after a minute it's all silence.
Then I have to apply changes again in audio settings and it begins to work again.
For now, it's obvious that Denon ASIO works best and I will continue that way for the moment. I will still investigate the WASAPI issue in parallell as time permits.
As a sidenote:
I have always wondered if using a separate soundcard (PCI-ex, not USB) works more stable together with MIDI controllers with built-in soundcards.
Then MIDI controller only has to TX/RX MIDI data instead of both MIDI and USB audio.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 7:14 am
Adion
Usually this kind of distortion in exclusive mode happens when the latency is too low, but at 500 samples that doesn't appear to be the case.
Btw, in shared mode you can probably get the 4 channels to appear by going to Playback Devices in windows sound options, select the device and click Configure. Then you should be able to select Quadrophonic or something similar instead of stereo.
Btw, in shared mode you can probably get the 4 channels to appear by going to Playback Devices in windows sound options, select the device and click Configure. Then you should be able to select Quadrophonic or something similar instead of stereo.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 7:42 am
VDJ Ron
A 4th gen. i5 should be fine..4 cores and a high clock speed @3.5ghz!
Watch out for Windows updates..they killed the Intel dual core laptops using Win 8. A whole core was dedicated to their activities plus @ 1gb of memory. It might be the same with Win 7. Microsoft and probably the governments of the West want everyone on Win 10 (security I suppose).
Win 10 does work well.
Hm..thats a good cpu!!!!
There is something odd going on with the wasapi drivers..they should just work.
Watch out for Windows updates..they killed the Intel dual core laptops using Win 8. A whole core was dedicated to their activities plus @ 1gb of memory. It might be the same with Win 7. Microsoft and probably the governments of the West want everyone on Win 10 (security I suppose).
Win 10 does work well.
Hm..thats a good cpu!!!!
There is something odd going on with the wasapi drivers..they should just work.
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 4:34 pm
Adion
If you had one core fully occupied with windows 8 that must have been a problem with your specific installation ron. I've never seen this myself, nor have I ever heard that this was a common problem with windows 8. (And on a laptop you'd easily notice since your fans would be on high all the time and your battery would last only an hour or so)
geposted Fri 28 Apr 17 @ 4:44 pm
