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Topic: It's NEVER free! - Page: 1

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geposted Mon 03 Aug 09 @ 12:37 am
The smartest thing my dad ever taught me was that "NOTHING in this world is FREE!"
 
Great Lesson! Slowly the industry is catching people and making them pay. If not to get the money but definitely to set examples.
 
islanboy wrote :
Great Lesson! Slowly the industry is catching people and making them pay. If not to get the money but definitely to set examples.


I'd say you have a very perverted view of justice if you support this kind of legistlation.

The purpose of any democratic justice system is to punish the offender in a sensible proportion to the crime committed - or to be exact, the harm caused. No matter what, no exceptions.

That kind of policy shows whose interests the US justice system primarly serves. Ruining peoples lives with redicelous fines just to make an example out of them is not justice, it's bully tactics.
 
AuralCandy.Net wrote :
Ruining peoples lives with redicelous fines just to make an example out of them is not justice, it's bully tactics.


I don't think he was voicing approval, he was supporting a warning. I agree this is a bully tactic, but. In almost every major industrialized nation those with money can afford to hire smart, driven, legal representation. It is believed justice is blind. It is sad that even though blind she (justice) can be guided by a large bank account.
 

When you look at crime and punishment, the punishment for crimes where money/TAX is concerned can be astronomical, where as serious human rights infringements such as murder and rape always seem short of justice. That's how I view it in the UK at least.
 
As far as i can see... none of you have one single song on your collection ilegally downloaded from internet ? That apply to netsearch also...

Regards !

;-)
 
how are they choosing these people with 20 and 30 songs and i know people who have thousands of files from p2p networks?
and what about the individuals from whom the songs came from?
edit: after researching, i found that they have been warned and sued in the past..
 
absolutely agree 100% on that statement bagpuss, how many times do you see the toe rags on asbos getting off with another warning for the umpteenth time, really boils my p...
 
Got to side with the Brits here.
I think that some areas of the UK system are just so far out of balance that it is difficult to see where Justice is actualy being done. I also think that the UK has become badly infected by the US Litigation craze. You can't do anything in the UK now without some slimey ambulance chasing, semi lawyer breathing down your neck.
Copying music or performances in any form without paying is wrong. I don't do it and dont have any time for those who do. But when you see stupid life ruining fines being passed out it just makes the big recording companies look even more greedy. Make the punishment fit the crime! Fine those who steal music? shure but keep some perspective and lock up the twats stealing cars for fun and not just for 7 days and a couple of hours community service.

Daz
 
Yea, Paris Hilton gets out early on DUI and I am sure she did not have to pay that kind of fine. Where is the justice in that?

A friend of mine was caught illegally downloading and he said the fine is relative to what you make. It could be as much as $5000 per song and as lillte as $1000. The RIAA brought him to court. He had a part time job (full time student) so he was fined $1000 per song. They caught him with 5 songs, so $5000 total was the ruleing. If you do the crime, that is a fair price.

But $675,000!? Wow, I know it is worng but, wow. That is all I have to say about that.
 
AuralCandy.Net wrote :
islanboy wrote :
Great Lesson! Slowly the industry is catching people and making them pay. If not to get the money but definitely to set examples.


I'd say you have a very perverted view of justice if you support this kind of legistlation.

The purpose of any democratic justice system is to punish the offender in a sensible proportion to the crime committed - or to be exact, the harm caused. No matter what, no exceptions.

That kind of policy shows whose interests the US justice system primarly serves. Ruining peoples lives with redicelous fines just to make an example out of them is not justice, it's bully tactics.


@AuralCandy no perverted view of justice here nor did I state supporting any type of legislation. I was just adding on to @djrobinhamilton comment about his dad teaching him that nothing is free. Forgot to quote him.

I don't fully agree with your statements because based on my experience living in different countries, I have seen justice applied in more extreme ways just to make an example. In this case making this type of (as you refer) bully tactic kindergarten level but that's for another conversation.

TearEmUp wrote :
AuralCandy.Net wrote :
Ruining peoples lives with redicelous fines just to make an example out of them is not justice, it's bully tactics.


I don't think he was voicing approval, he was supporting a warning. I agree this is a bully tactic, but. In almost every major industrialized nation those with money can afford to hire smart, driven, legal representation. It is believed justice is blind. It is sad that even though blind she (justice) can be guided by a large bank account.



@TearEmUp so true.

For all great dialogue & definitely of course for those of us that drive; we all follow & don't exceed the speed limit! ;) But for those that get caught and fined . . . OUCH in the pocket!

Cheers!
 
that fine has the violate some kind of excessive punishment law... i wouldnt be surprised if it is a hoax to scare people
 
dat_boi_tj wrote :
that fine has the violate some kind of excessive punishment law... i wouldnt be surprised if it is a hoax to scare people


Unless it is, in fact, a legal suit. In that case a person MUST pay damages equal to what a judge/jury can be convinced that the victim has lost thorugh the entire operation of the accused. That means every single sale from every single person, that could have bought what they didn't need to buy. Lawyers that defend these companies, have formulas and guidelines (judges and juries have the same ones at hand as well) as to what may have been lost by the victim. Then the victim needs to be made right (paid back), plus any penalties defined by law as to the extent of the crime. The penalties all have minimum and maximum sentencing (and fines)too, and most of these penalties/fines are actually agreed upon outside the courtroom between the two parties. If a person wants to spend more money than the minimum penalty to defend himself and still be advised that he may still get the maximum and knows inside out that he (himself) is guilty beyond doubt, then he needs to do some serious math.
 
but as a downloader, the damages are only equal to 99 cent per song due to the fact that 99 cent is all that they would have earned if he were to purchase the song... as where an uploader could possibly be 22,000 dollars because that is 22,000 potential customers
 
I heard this whining, crying, jerk-off on the radio today, making up all kind of excuses for his illegal behavior. Justice is not fair, has never been, and will never be, so get over it. You don't have to like the laws, but you do have to obey them. If you don't, take it like a man and stop crying. This college educated idiot, knew what the law was, and thought he was above it. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime. End of story. He even tried to say that Kurt Cobain (another jerk-off), would not have approved of the big record companies exploiting this law. I'm sorry, but where did Kurt get the money for the drugs, the shotgun he used to blow out his worthless brains, and the mansion he was in when he did it? Here's a bright idea for listening to new music for free. It's called the radio. you like what you hear, go buy it.
 

Personally I estimate that 9 out of 10 computer owners are guilty of piracy, if someone hasn't downloaded a movie, they've downloaded an MP3 or installed cracked software. If everyone guilty of this was fined it would literally generate billions of whatever currency you like.

The fact is that as of now, the majority of people do not consider these activities as a serious crime. People will only stop if it becomes virtually impossible, or if they receive a warning letter in the post, or get prosecuted.

Perhaps things will change one day, the powers that be may be able to "catch" people in greater quantities or put a serious spanner in the works (maybe windows will perform copyright checks before allowing you to download anything, in the way youtube does when one uploads a video).

The children of the future may be raised to hold a different view, but as of now virtually everyone is doing it.
 
For that matter anyone who has ever xerox'd a page from a book, magazine, photograph......alll copywrite violations too.

Technology is moving so much faster than sociology and human's ability to comprehend what we are creating (or even recognizing what we are really creating) that the laws and punishments can not keep up in any sane manner and so most of the laws are knee-jerk reactions lobbied for by scared industries who refuse to change their business model to keep up with socities desires, abilities and technologies.

The very definitions of art, performance and intellectual properties are being remolded right before our eyes into a shared societal resource and people think of it as their right to experience it just as the air we breathe. Eventually when enough of society believes it is a right it will become a right due to the momentum of the ideas.The genie has left the bottle, it is never goin back in and the music industry (and all media for that matter) needs to wake up, see the future and totally rethink their business model if they still want to be in the business of producing music, software, games, movies, etc. for profit. The days of selling something that can so easily be reduced to mere 1's and 0's in cyberspace are gone forever and what lingers is simply a mirage of "the glory days".

The age of intellectual property belonging to individuals or corporate entities is dying. Intellectual property belongs to all of mankind for the spiritual and intellectual betterment of all mankind. Most people are still too blinded by monetary economics and materialistic values to realize monetary based societies are slowly being phased out. In the not too distant future the human collective will provide to everyone as needed all the necessetties of life and people will be free to explore their passions and desires (making music included) for all to enjoy for the sheer pleasure of it's enjoyment. Musicians will not need to work to be provided for, so they will create music because that s what they love to do. We will not need to Dj to pay our bills so we will be free to indulge our passion because we enjoy creating and making others feel good. This is how it will be in all areas of what we now consider work and money as we know it will become obsolete.

Since this day will be realized long after I have died and moved on we must now fight the oppressive corporate megalopolies and government taxations that are ruingin our current lives.
 
dj-e-lectric,

Well done you've just receieved the post of the month award, that was a good read.

Only the very few experience the true benefits of capitalism, and these people are becoming fewer with the gap between rich and poor growing ever larger. Things are changing, not only with the current economic climate (which we will be in for years) but also in the way we value things.
 
bagpuss wrote :
dj-e-lectric,

Well done you've just receieved the post of the month award, that was a good read.

Only the very few experience the true benefits of capitalism, and these people are becoming fewer with the gap between rich and poor growing ever larger. Things are changing, not only with the current economic climate (which we will be in for years) but also in the way we value things.


Can't take all the credit, I do watch a lot of Star Trek.....I fthey think they have a problem stopping music downloads now what will they do when we actually have "replicators".

We are closer than some think as we already have production models of "3-d Fax" machines that can actually scan in the plans for a 3d object at one end and create a plastic replica at the other end. Right now it is limited to 12" x12" x12" or smaller objects, but it is only a matter of time before you can download a Mercedes in your garage.
 
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