Asott
Hey guys.
So Ive been mixing songs just for a few months now, I got a external Mixer that I use with my computer to make things work. Im getting curious on how mixing by not using a computer is, and what im most concern about is the syncing. I use my mixer with the software program called Traktor. Anyway the sync button, the best thing ever created in my opinion, the possibilty to sync 2 songs this fast. Is that possible when live DJing aswell, when using turntables instead as CD players instead of a computer? or is everything pure manualy done? It seems way to hard to match 2 songs purely manualy but is this how the Pro DJs does it?
Thanks
So Ive been mixing songs just for a few months now, I got a external Mixer that I use with my computer to make things work. Im getting curious on how mixing by not using a computer is, and what im most concern about is the syncing. I use my mixer with the software program called Traktor. Anyway the sync button, the best thing ever created in my opinion, the possibilty to sync 2 songs this fast. Is that possible when live DJing aswell, when using turntables instead as CD players instead of a computer? or is everything pure manualy done? It seems way to hard to match 2 songs purely manualy but is this how the Pro DJs does it?
Thanks
geposted Fri 10 Jun 11 @ 1:52 pm
Asott
Follow up:
So I decided to try it out myself, by manualy match the songs. At first it was incredibly hard but after a while I started to get the flow going.
Few things that struck me was that suddenly what I heard and what I saw on the monitor was show 2 different things. Usualy the Program Traktor has this middle spot where it sync its song when using the Sync Button. But by only using my ear I managed to beat match 2 songs very good and according to Traktor they were out of sync. So I decided to not rely on the program itself and tried to mix em and it sounded awesome.
Have I done something wrong here or is it correct that what u hear and what the program shows can be 2 different things?
The Beat matching process and the mix itself also sound a lot better while just using hearing the song with my eyes cloed.
So I decided to try it out myself, by manualy match the songs. At first it was incredibly hard but after a while I started to get the flow going.
Few things that struck me was that suddenly what I heard and what I saw on the monitor was show 2 different things. Usualy the Program Traktor has this middle spot where it sync its song when using the Sync Button. But by only using my ear I managed to beat match 2 songs very good and according to Traktor they were out of sync. So I decided to not rely on the program itself and tried to mix em and it sounded awesome.
Have I done something wrong here or is it correct that what u hear and what the program shows can be 2 different things?
The Beat matching process and the mix itself also sound a lot better while just using hearing the song with my eyes cloed.
geposted Fri 10 Jun 11 @ 5:09 pm
the SOUND INSURGENT
You should always trust your ears as you have seen the program was not right. How I use the sync is when I wanna mix tracks fast. But I just use the sync to match bpms.......I still have to eq and drop the track in at the right spot or else it'll still sound like crap.
Always trust your ears first when it comes to Djing
Huey
Always trust your ears first when it comes to Djing
Huey
geposted Fri 10 Jun 11 @ 7:25 pm
dj Forged
+1, I use it to match bpm's as well, but that button takes the joy out of syncing by ear and pulling off great mixes manually.
geposted Sat 11 Jun 11 @ 7:34 am
Blulite
personally i done away with my sync button, i re-mapped it to a stop button.
for matching bpm's i re-mapped my pitch control knob and pitch bend buttons to work like:
pitch control knob increases/decreases BPM by 1
pitch bend buttons increase/decrease BPM by 0.1
this way i turn the pitch control to get me near what i want, and the pitch bend to fine tune.
i always found with the sync button if your not paying full attention your track structure lands out of place. i rely heavily on ear, wave form and eq to do my mixing. and the sync button sometimes proved to take more effort than if i just mixed in my regular way.
@Asott, check out elliskins dj tutor on youtube for tips on mixing without a computer.youll find his .tuts really informative and end easy to follow.
for matching bpm's i re-mapped my pitch control knob and pitch bend buttons to work like:
pitch control knob increases/decreases BPM by 1
pitch bend buttons increase/decrease BPM by 0.1
this way i turn the pitch control to get me near what i want, and the pitch bend to fine tune.
i always found with the sync button if your not paying full attention your track structure lands out of place. i rely heavily on ear, wave form and eq to do my mixing. and the sync button sometimes proved to take more effort than if i just mixed in my regular way.
@Asott, check out elliskins dj tutor on youtube for tips on mixing without a computer.youll find his .tuts really informative and end easy to follow.
geposted Sun 12 Jun 11 @ 5:33 am
the SOUND INSURGENT
That's why you don't hit the sync button while a track is playing...........you only hit it to match bpms and it doesn't have to playing to match bpms. Learn to use your tools cause while your pitch bending in your headphones wasting time I'm already blending in my next tracks.............
Huey
Huey
geposted Sun 12 Jun 11 @ 6:58 am
Asott
Using Sync button to match the BPMs I agree with that its a perfect time saver.
@Blulite I have checked his tutorials out and they are great indeed, still...
Ive got a few other questions aswell if thats okay..
How do you know when to start the second deck so you it get in the perfect place you want to fade it in at?
A lot of peoples talks about cueing and such but I havent really understood what it really is about.
Right now, first im doing is matching BPMs after that im finding a good spot on deck 2 where I want the new song to fade in at, and trying to find a good spot for a perfect reloop. Then I match the beats and, When the song on deck 1 has come to a good spot to be faded out at I use the crossfader and EQs and after a while when deck 2 is faded in, I put the reloop off.
Most peoples talks about putting cueing at 1st Beat. Ive tried this but it seems way to hard.
What always happens is that:
The Crossfading process always turns out to be late or to early and/or The Beatmatching isnt good at all, since you only got like 10-15 seconds to beat match the songs and adjusting EQs and all.
How do you do the whole process? and what is cueing really about?
@Blulite I have checked his tutorials out and they are great indeed, still...
Ive got a few other questions aswell if thats okay..
How do you know when to start the second deck so you it get in the perfect place you want to fade it in at?
A lot of peoples talks about cueing and such but I havent really understood what it really is about.
Right now, first im doing is matching BPMs after that im finding a good spot on deck 2 where I want the new song to fade in at, and trying to find a good spot for a perfect reloop. Then I match the beats and, When the song on deck 1 has come to a good spot to be faded out at I use the crossfader and EQs and after a while when deck 2 is faded in, I put the reloop off.
Most peoples talks about putting cueing at 1st Beat. Ive tried this but it seems way to hard.
What always happens is that:
The Crossfading process always turns out to be late or to early and/or The Beatmatching isnt good at all, since you only got like 10-15 seconds to beat match the songs and adjusting EQs and all.
How do you do the whole process? and what is cueing really about?
geposted Mon 13 Jun 11 @ 10:55 am
jboerlage
Gents, Asott,
I must admit I love the auto sync feature especially in combination with smart_play option. BUT... you need to be sure the automatic detected BMP is correct, when loading an unknown track, allways check:
- Is the first beat really the first beat?? You can hear this.. just count.. 1..2..3...4...1...2...3...4 and the beat on which the accents are, the voice starts etc etc that is your one.
- Is the beat not entirely shifted. Especially in Hip hop, where there is an extra basedrum on the 7/8th of the bar VDJ can get confused.
Asott, for your mixing:
Looping before mixing is a very safe way. But will be very recognizable and boring eventually. Allmost every electronic song is made up from patterns which consist of 4 bars of 4 beats, making it 16 beats in total. To recognize where they are, look for the intro's, drop in and drop outs. You can actually allready see it on the waveform!
So when mixing in your other song, not only do you need to be on the first beat of the bar, but also the first beat of the pattern. Why? Because than in 90% of the cases your intro's, drop in and drop outs will be in sync, making great mixing possibilities.
Now.. what you can try and practice with something easy, try minimal or minimal techno, that is mainly rithm. (I'll get to the next tip on harmonics later). Take a skin that supports SMART play, like TCmania ver 2.3 by djdad. SMART play will make sure the second record will be synced automatically and the first beats of the bar will allign.
To illustrate, open up this mix: http://i.mixcloud.com/C2wL9
- Play record A on the left deck
- Crossfader full to left
- Goto the first beat of a new patern and press your queue button. This is where you mark that your record is supposed to be starting. So each time you press stop it will go back to that point.
- Set your crossfader halfway between left and center. Leave the eq as it is to hear what happens.
- Now wait.. wait until you recocognize the end of a pattern, for example a build up. In the above mix you have an example on 3:56. It swells up.... and goes on into a new pattern.
- On the first beat of the new pattern, press PLAY. The first beats should now be in sync because of SMARTplay. Because of the previous buildup it wont be aqward to hear some extra sound.
- This is where your mixing starts, and dont be hasty on this point, just let it run and enjoy the tracks together, let them merge, slowely giving more balance to deck B.. and when Deck B comes into a nice climax (end of the pattern) let it build up and finally... push the fader all the way to the right on the first beat of the new pattern.
You'll hear this trick over in over in the example mix, and when you start listening closely to other mixes you'll start to recognize it done there as well.
When you've mastered that.... its time to move to more melodic tunes, and start thinking about harmony.
Now.. listen and practice :P Enjoy!
I must admit I love the auto sync feature especially in combination with smart_play option. BUT... you need to be sure the automatic detected BMP is correct, when loading an unknown track, allways check:
- Is the first beat really the first beat?? You can hear this.. just count.. 1..2..3...4...1...2...3...4 and the beat on which the accents are, the voice starts etc etc that is your one.
- Is the beat not entirely shifted. Especially in Hip hop, where there is an extra basedrum on the 7/8th of the bar VDJ can get confused.
Asott, for your mixing:
Looping before mixing is a very safe way. But will be very recognizable and boring eventually. Allmost every electronic song is made up from patterns which consist of 4 bars of 4 beats, making it 16 beats in total. To recognize where they are, look for the intro's, drop in and drop outs. You can actually allready see it on the waveform!
So when mixing in your other song, not only do you need to be on the first beat of the bar, but also the first beat of the pattern. Why? Because than in 90% of the cases your intro's, drop in and drop outs will be in sync, making great mixing possibilities.
Now.. what you can try and practice with something easy, try minimal or minimal techno, that is mainly rithm. (I'll get to the next tip on harmonics later). Take a skin that supports SMART play, like TCmania ver 2.3 by djdad. SMART play will make sure the second record will be synced automatically and the first beats of the bar will allign.
To illustrate, open up this mix: http://i.mixcloud.com/C2wL9
- Play record A on the left deck
- Crossfader full to left
- Goto the first beat of a new patern and press your queue button. This is where you mark that your record is supposed to be starting. So each time you press stop it will go back to that point.
- Set your crossfader halfway between left and center. Leave the eq as it is to hear what happens.
- Now wait.. wait until you recocognize the end of a pattern, for example a build up. In the above mix you have an example on 3:56. It swells up.... and goes on into a new pattern.
- On the first beat of the new pattern, press PLAY. The first beats should now be in sync because of SMARTplay. Because of the previous buildup it wont be aqward to hear some extra sound.
- This is where your mixing starts, and dont be hasty on this point, just let it run and enjoy the tracks together, let them merge, slowely giving more balance to deck B.. and when Deck B comes into a nice climax (end of the pattern) let it build up and finally... push the fader all the way to the right on the first beat of the new pattern.
You'll hear this trick over in over in the example mix, and when you start listening closely to other mixes you'll start to recognize it done there as well.
When you've mastered that.... its time to move to more melodic tunes, and start thinking about harmony.
Now.. listen and practice :P Enjoy!
geposted Wed 22 Jun 11 @ 11:35 am
Blulite
@Ascott, to determine the point in a track where you need to play it from is usually down to experience or knowledge of your collection. However, with today’s advanced waveforms to can get a visual input of where the track breaks down, builds up etc.. it’s a matter of looking and listening, you can cue up in your headphones while your looking at the waveform to get a better idea of where the best place for a transition would be.
On another note, over time you will develop skills enough to not need to do so much looking and listening. Finding track structures that fit is not always a necessity. It is much better to use under mixing (use EQ instead of X fader), harmonics (keeping key tones within no more than 2 semitones, see www.mixedinkey.com) and your ear than to think too much about the mix.
I personally use, as does just about everyone else, harmonic mixing and under mixing A LOT.
Try mixing without your headphones for a while and get used to hearing the next tracks overlay. Leave your X fader in the middle and only use your EQ to mix.. Start with all the EQ of track 2 turned to zero and gradually bring the song in one range at a time whilst fading out the corresponding range on track 1 (ranges = bass (low), Mid range (mid) and treble (high).)
Learn also to beat count as Jboerlage mentioned. 4 beats in a bar and four bars in a verse. So in total you need to count 16 beats for 1 verse. You can count them in up to 16’s, 8’s or 4’s, its up to you.
When beat counting listen to a track and……lets say….it is coming to a break down…when the last bass kick hits start counting 1.2.3.4.1.2.3.4.1.2.3.4.1.2.3.and play! that’s the play point where you can play your next track. This is only an example, but count along with the bass line also and you can if you want to bring in a track over a bass line too.
Another example is to play a track with a lengthy bass section and count the bars, find a nice section of percussion, harmonics or vocals on track two and bring in track two by beat counting and undermixing in the same way. As I mentioned before, try this without headphones and learn to hear each range of the tracks and what differences it makes to the mix during a transition.
What you will learn whilst doing this is that there is no specific place in a track to make a transition the best it can be. Now don’t get me wrong, if your building a set for say a specific genre event, then it is possible to find perfect transition spots. But when mixing on the fly its more about good well practiced techniques that will keep the beat going and your music flowing.
Cueing, is using your headphones to listen to your next track before playing it. this gives you the ability to find the first beat of your track or a section of your track you want to play from.
finding the first beat doesnt always mean the "first" beat or bass kick etc....the first beat is also the point at which you want to play the track from.
Also judging by your description of whats happening with regards to your cueing, it sounds like your mixing just the end and beginning of the tracks. There is no need to do this, you can mix in mid track which is how most people do it anyway. (Take the best 2-3 mins of a track and transition regularly to keep the beat flowing)
If your having trouble with beat matching, chances are your not matching your bpm’s correctly before playing the next track. Try to keep the tracks within a 5 bpm rage of one another. And tweak them manually to match or pitch bend during your transition to keep the pitch slightly adjusted while your under mixing your next track.
Key tone matching and bpm matching are a major part of mixing to create smooth transitions. Do this:
Open vdj, goto your main music collection folder > right click > scan for bpm’s
This will detect the bpm and keytone of each and every track. Wait for this to complete, it may take a while, but in the mean time drag the dialogue box out of the way and in the browser section of vdj, not the floder menu on the right, the brower section on the left/middle. Right click the bar that says Title, Artist etc…this will bring up a list of what info is to be displayed in the browser, be sure that bpm, key and numeric key are checked and alter your browser so you are able to see each section clearly, also you can remove any unwanted sections to your preference.
Once your scan is complete and you goto your collection, each track will show its bpm and 2 keytones. One numeric and one in flats. As already mentioned choose tracks within 5 bpm, click the bpm title to sort by bpm. And choose tracks within 1 semitone higher or lower than the one your playing. For example if your track says numeric key 8A, then you have three options, you can use a track that corresponds to 7A, 8A, 9A.
This will give you really a really good selection of tracks to work with and you will be able to hear the transition without it being overpowering. You can also go 2 semitones for power mixing or increasing, decreasing the energy of the mix. But that’s a little more advanced, lets stick to the regular bits first.
A transition doesn’t have to only be as I said before at beginning to end of the tracks. And doesn’t have to last 15-20 seconds. You can make a transition last as long as necessary to complete it smoothly. Hence why under mixing and harmonics plays a huge role in successful transitions.
I think however, by now your head will be swimming and swirling with trying to take in all this info, so ill leave it at that for now. And wait to see how you get on with it all.
Good luck and happy mixing, what ive just told you will seem like a huge learning curve, but believe me itll be worth it once you have played around for a while and got your head round it.
All the best, john.
P.S my opinion, forget sync buttons and "smart" play, if your smart, you will learn the proper ways to do things before moving onto using time saving tools.
it is my personal opinion that time saving tools are for experienced dj's. dj's that are doing other things such as:
track selection,
playlist building,
request searches,
eq tweaks,
undermixing for ambiance,
ambiant fading,
cutting,
looping,
recording loops and samples,
effects,
effecct tweaks,
playing loops and samples,
cueing,
harmonic matching,
finding your next cd,
mapping the next set of samples for use,
prepping your scratch,
scratching,
scratching your nuts.....the list is endless....but these are all things that experienced dj's do during and between mixes. time saving tools are there to save time, not to be used as a way to work your set. old school is cool...and so ar time saving tools, but you gotta learn the right way or the way will be wrong. anyone can use sync and smart play. but gathering the correct knowlege to start with is more important. and it is not unusuall for an experienced dj to be doing more than one item off that list at one time.
start as you mean to go on...peace!
On another note, over time you will develop skills enough to not need to do so much looking and listening. Finding track structures that fit is not always a necessity. It is much better to use under mixing (use EQ instead of X fader), harmonics (keeping key tones within no more than 2 semitones, see www.mixedinkey.com) and your ear than to think too much about the mix.
I personally use, as does just about everyone else, harmonic mixing and under mixing A LOT.
Try mixing without your headphones for a while and get used to hearing the next tracks overlay. Leave your X fader in the middle and only use your EQ to mix.. Start with all the EQ of track 2 turned to zero and gradually bring the song in one range at a time whilst fading out the corresponding range on track 1 (ranges = bass (low), Mid range (mid) and treble (high).)
Learn also to beat count as Jboerlage mentioned. 4 beats in a bar and four bars in a verse. So in total you need to count 16 beats for 1 verse. You can count them in up to 16’s, 8’s or 4’s, its up to you.
When beat counting listen to a track and……lets say….it is coming to a break down…when the last bass kick hits start counting 1.2.3.4.1.2.3.4.1.2.3.4.1.2.3.and play! that’s the play point where you can play your next track. This is only an example, but count along with the bass line also and you can if you want to bring in a track over a bass line too.
Another example is to play a track with a lengthy bass section and count the bars, find a nice section of percussion, harmonics or vocals on track two and bring in track two by beat counting and undermixing in the same way. As I mentioned before, try this without headphones and learn to hear each range of the tracks and what differences it makes to the mix during a transition.
What you will learn whilst doing this is that there is no specific place in a track to make a transition the best it can be. Now don’t get me wrong, if your building a set for say a specific genre event, then it is possible to find perfect transition spots. But when mixing on the fly its more about good well practiced techniques that will keep the beat going and your music flowing.
Cueing, is using your headphones to listen to your next track before playing it. this gives you the ability to find the first beat of your track or a section of your track you want to play from.
finding the first beat doesnt always mean the "first" beat or bass kick etc....the first beat is also the point at which you want to play the track from.
Also judging by your description of whats happening with regards to your cueing, it sounds like your mixing just the end and beginning of the tracks. There is no need to do this, you can mix in mid track which is how most people do it anyway. (Take the best 2-3 mins of a track and transition regularly to keep the beat flowing)
If your having trouble with beat matching, chances are your not matching your bpm’s correctly before playing the next track. Try to keep the tracks within a 5 bpm rage of one another. And tweak them manually to match or pitch bend during your transition to keep the pitch slightly adjusted while your under mixing your next track.
Key tone matching and bpm matching are a major part of mixing to create smooth transitions. Do this:
Open vdj, goto your main music collection folder > right click > scan for bpm’s
This will detect the bpm and keytone of each and every track. Wait for this to complete, it may take a while, but in the mean time drag the dialogue box out of the way and in the browser section of vdj, not the floder menu on the right, the brower section on the left/middle. Right click the bar that says Title, Artist etc…this will bring up a list of what info is to be displayed in the browser, be sure that bpm, key and numeric key are checked and alter your browser so you are able to see each section clearly, also you can remove any unwanted sections to your preference.
Once your scan is complete and you goto your collection, each track will show its bpm and 2 keytones. One numeric and one in flats. As already mentioned choose tracks within 5 bpm, click the bpm title to sort by bpm. And choose tracks within 1 semitone higher or lower than the one your playing. For example if your track says numeric key 8A, then you have three options, you can use a track that corresponds to 7A, 8A, 9A.
This will give you really a really good selection of tracks to work with and you will be able to hear the transition without it being overpowering. You can also go 2 semitones for power mixing or increasing, decreasing the energy of the mix. But that’s a little more advanced, lets stick to the regular bits first.
A transition doesn’t have to only be as I said before at beginning to end of the tracks. And doesn’t have to last 15-20 seconds. You can make a transition last as long as necessary to complete it smoothly. Hence why under mixing and harmonics plays a huge role in successful transitions.
I think however, by now your head will be swimming and swirling with trying to take in all this info, so ill leave it at that for now. And wait to see how you get on with it all.
Good luck and happy mixing, what ive just told you will seem like a huge learning curve, but believe me itll be worth it once you have played around for a while and got your head round it.
All the best, john.
P.S my opinion, forget sync buttons and "smart" play, if your smart, you will learn the proper ways to do things before moving onto using time saving tools.
it is my personal opinion that time saving tools are for experienced dj's. dj's that are doing other things such as:
track selection,
playlist building,
request searches,
eq tweaks,
undermixing for ambiance,
ambiant fading,
cutting,
looping,
recording loops and samples,
effects,
effecct tweaks,
playing loops and samples,
cueing,
harmonic matching,
finding your next cd,
mapping the next set of samples for use,
prepping your scratch,
scratching,
scratching your nuts.....the list is endless....but these are all things that experienced dj's do during and between mixes. time saving tools are there to save time, not to be used as a way to work your set. old school is cool...and so ar time saving tools, but you gotta learn the right way or the way will be wrong. anyone can use sync and smart play. but gathering the correct knowlege to start with is more important. and it is not unusuall for an experienced dj to be doing more than one item off that list at one time.
start as you mean to go on...peace!
geposted Thu 23 Jun 11 @ 12:42 pm
jboerlage
Nice addition to the whole thread BluLite, and happy bd if that still counts ;)
[quote=Blulite.
P.S my opinion, forget sync buttons and "smart" play, if your smart, you will learn the proper ways to do things before moving onto using time saving tools.[/quote]
If ofcourse all depends on the controller he has and the latency soundcard, without the right gear it can be a bitch. If he really wants to learn this the proper way like most of us did he should goto the local 'gear for hire' and get himself two SL1200's a mixer and 6 records to play gray in a weekend :P
[quote=Blulite.
P.S my opinion, forget sync buttons and "smart" play, if your smart, you will learn the proper ways to do things before moving onto using time saving tools.[/quote]
If ofcourse all depends on the controller he has and the latency soundcard, without the right gear it can be a bitch. If he really wants to learn this the proper way like most of us did he should goto the local 'gear for hire' and get himself two SL1200's a mixer and 6 records to play gray in a weekend :P
geposted Thu 23 Jun 11 @ 1:08 pm
Blulite
yup, happy bday still counts till midnight. thanks bro.
regarding controllers, i dont think the controller really makes much difference, i learned to mix vinyl on 2 beat up old belt drive gemini TT's and a mixer from some never heard of company..plus one of the tt's had a damaged stylus lol.
the point im aiming at though, is if you practice enough and learn the hard way, then it becomes much easier to understand the reasons behind the usage of tech tools.
just slapping at a load of "make it easier" tools, in my opinion doesnt mean your a dj. if you catch my drift...
a youtube video pops to mind about being a dj lol. all i can remember about it is the guy had a name and that was it...and the fact he said "i want the b**ches" a lot. lol
i use the mp3 e2 and before that the mp3 mk1, not the greatest controlers, but i can mix a mean set with them both. i strongly believe that you can become a good dj no matter what equipment you have, its not about the quality of the hardware, its about the quality of how you use and utilise what you have.
which brings me back to Ascott's questions, if he has no knowlege of what the things he is reading are, then he wont be able to progress as fast as he probably can. now this is just my view, but teaching someone about the tech tools is in my eyes, only a good suggestion if the students knowlege of the theory behind the system is up to speed.
as i see it at the moment, Ascott has a lot of areas to get to grips with yet so i feel obliged to start from the beginning.
however, i will be re reading your post several times because i personally have no idea what the smart play thing is all about. so ive learned something from you today and probably will learn more in the future lol
peace, john.
regarding controllers, i dont think the controller really makes much difference, i learned to mix vinyl on 2 beat up old belt drive gemini TT's and a mixer from some never heard of company..plus one of the tt's had a damaged stylus lol.
the point im aiming at though, is if you practice enough and learn the hard way, then it becomes much easier to understand the reasons behind the usage of tech tools.
just slapping at a load of "make it easier" tools, in my opinion doesnt mean your a dj. if you catch my drift...
a youtube video pops to mind about being a dj lol. all i can remember about it is the guy had a name and that was it...and the fact he said "i want the b**ches" a lot. lol
i use the mp3 e2 and before that the mp3 mk1, not the greatest controlers, but i can mix a mean set with them both. i strongly believe that you can become a good dj no matter what equipment you have, its not about the quality of the hardware, its about the quality of how you use and utilise what you have.
which brings me back to Ascott's questions, if he has no knowlege of what the things he is reading are, then he wont be able to progress as fast as he probably can. now this is just my view, but teaching someone about the tech tools is in my eyes, only a good suggestion if the students knowlege of the theory behind the system is up to speed.
as i see it at the moment, Ascott has a lot of areas to get to grips with yet so i feel obliged to start from the beginning.
however, i will be re reading your post several times because i personally have no idea what the smart play thing is all about. so ive learned something from you today and probably will learn more in the future lol
peace, john.
geposted Thu 23 Jun 11 @ 3:53 pm
jboerlage
@john,
Yeah, lets see Asotts effort pay off (if we ever get to see ;).
And on the Smartplay, its exactly meant for what you wrote; speed. I work very simular to how you describe, everything harmonic, using waveforms to determine when to kick in, loops, effects etc etc. Tried a four deck mix last sunday and than its just a must to be speedy.
Chill and get some bd drinks!
Yeah, lets see Asotts effort pay off (if we ever get to see ;).
And on the Smartplay, its exactly meant for what you wrote; speed. I work very simular to how you describe, everything harmonic, using waveforms to determine when to kick in, loops, effects etc etc. Tried a four deck mix last sunday and than its just a must to be speedy.
Chill and get some bd drinks!
geposted Thu 23 Jun 11 @ 4:02 pm
Blulite
this is chilling lol, drinks are on friday night. i tend not to sign into forums when ive been drinking cuz ive woken up on several occasions and found abuse and stupidity thrown around lol.
so thats a no no.
im gonna pop over to the wiki and see if i can find more info on the smart play, if its not there, can you post a thread detailing the smart play system please?
oh i forgot to mention also @Ascott, go over to http://www.harmonic-mixing.com/ for more info on harmonic mixing and keytone usage tips.
its also a good idea to incorporate the camelot wheel into your desktop background for quick reference if needed ;) thats what i did. it helps me a lot when im using VDJ, Audacity and ableton. (plus i have a bright yellow Mustang GT on there too so thats cool to look at)
so thats a no no.
im gonna pop over to the wiki and see if i can find more info on the smart play, if its not there, can you post a thread detailing the smart play system please?
oh i forgot to mention also @Ascott, go over to http://www.harmonic-mixing.com/ for more info on harmonic mixing and keytone usage tips.
its also a good idea to incorporate the camelot wheel into your desktop background for quick reference if needed ;) thats what i did. it helps me a lot when im using VDJ, Audacity and ableton. (plus i have a bright yellow Mustang GT on there too so thats cool to look at)
geposted Thu 23 Jun 11 @ 8:55 pm
DJ KYLE THOM
Always always always learn to mix properly before even touching the sync button.
It's a great skill to have incase your laptop ever breaks and you're doing a live performance.
It's a great skill to have incase your laptop ever breaks and you're doing a live performance.
geposted Thu 07 Jul 11 @ 7:34 pm
Blulite
amen to that
geposted Tue 12 Jul 11 @ 6:35 pm
Felt (PT)
How do you guys feel about those who claim that people who use software/sync buttons while performing are not real DJs? Is it just a matter of opinion? I mean, yes, using sync buttons does help and is way easier than manual beat-matching, but proper mixing is not just using a sync button. You've got to know your music, what people want to hear, what a solid, cohesive mix/set can sound like (which song to start it with, which songs will escalate better, which song is the icing on the cake), knowing how to count your beats (4/4, 16/16) so you can pick the exact spot where a song ends and you can start the next one, proper handling of your EQ and volume knobs so as not to cause audio clipping, and so forth. If modern technologies allow you to perform better while still leaving most of the work to yourself, why not take advantage of them? I mean, I get it, you've been DJing for a decade and a half and you're used to vinyl and not having any software, but things evolve, and so should the way you think.
geposted Sat 23 Jul 11 @ 8:33 pm
synthet1c
my opinion is...
its okay to use it if you can do it without sync, If you rely on sync when practicing your going to get a shock using cdj1000's which are still the primary deck in a lot of smaller clubs...
its okay to use it if you can do it without sync, If you rely on sync when practicing your going to get a shock using cdj1000's which are still the primary deck in a lot of smaller clubs...
geposted Sat 23 Jul 11 @ 9:05 pm
Blulite
+1
get rid of sync buttons all together untill you are compitent enough to beatmatch without them. personally i dont tend to use the sync button at all. but since i got my mixrtack pro ive started using it as the pitch slider isnt that great and ive not got round to remappng it yet.
i only use it to match up the bpm's once ive used the pitch slider to get it as close as possible.
get rid of sync buttons all together untill you are compitent enough to beatmatch without them. personally i dont tend to use the sync button at all. but since i got my mixrtack pro ive started using it as the pitch slider isnt that great and ive not got round to remappng it yet.
i only use it to match up the bpm's once ive used the pitch slider to get it as close as possible.
geposted Sun 24 Jul 11 @ 4:26 am
Felt (PT)
But isn't it about having the charisma and the entertainment skills to please a crowd for hours? I mean, I get it, there's this feud between old school DJs and 'modern' (and I use that term lightly) DJs, and I understand that a lot of DJs will call it cheating, but if it helps me save time when mixing and provides better fluidity, then why not?
Not saying that I'll never stop using it (I intend to practice mixing using my controller's Jog Wheels and whatnot), but if I have an ear for music and the ability to entertain a crowd with the right tunes, I don't see the big deal. For me, it's as simple as: if you use it, fine, if you don't use it and don't need it, that's fine too. What I do agree on is that you shouldn't rely on it 100% of the time.
Not saying that I'll never stop using it (I intend to practice mixing using my controller's Jog Wheels and whatnot), but if I have an ear for music and the ability to entertain a crowd with the right tunes, I don't see the big deal. For me, it's as simple as: if you use it, fine, if you don't use it and don't need it, that's fine too. What I do agree on is that you shouldn't rely on it 100% of the time.
geposted Mon 25 Jul 11 @ 12:03 pm
Blulite
what you point out is valid, however if your mixing with the snyc, then your not learning to use pitch control or pitch bend, track nudging, manual bpm matching, beat matching, track structure etc etc..
sync buttons are the reason we hear so many shady sets uploaded by crap dj's. the same dj's that undercut the pro's and take their jobs. the same ones you hear in some clubs week after week because theyre cheap.
a pro dj and most will back me up on this, will either not use sync at all, or only use it as a fast bpm match.
i would rather use my pitch controls to bpm match, but if the sync is available i occasionally use it for a backup incase im sampling or looping etc.
that way i just have to jab the button and carry on working on timing my samples or loops.
the sync is a tool that i believe should be used lightly and only for the right reasons.
sync buttons are the reason we hear so many shady sets uploaded by crap dj's. the same dj's that undercut the pro's and take their jobs. the same ones you hear in some clubs week after week because theyre cheap.
a pro dj and most will back me up on this, will either not use sync at all, or only use it as a fast bpm match.
i would rather use my pitch controls to bpm match, but if the sync is available i occasionally use it for a backup incase im sampling or looping etc.
that way i just have to jab the button and carry on working on timing my samples or loops.
the sync is a tool that i believe should be used lightly and only for the right reasons.
geposted Mon 25 Jul 11 @ 12:37 pm
