VDJ Ron
Some typical data.
Crucial CT2000MX500SSD1Z 2000 GB 2.5 Inch 7 mm M x 500 SATA Solid State Drive with 9.5 mm Adapter
by Crucial
4.7 out of 5 stars 896 customer reviews
| 218 answered questions
RRP: £308.39
Price: £240.24 & FREE Delivery in the UK. Delivery Details
You Save: £68.15 (22%)
Note: This item is eligible for click and collect. Details
1 new from £240.24 1 used from £235.44
Capacity: 2 TB
Customer Package Type: Frustration-Free Packaging
Sequential reads/writes up to 560/510 MB/s and random reads/writes up to 95/90k on all file types
Accelerated by Micron 3D NAND technology
Integrated power loss immunity preserves all your saved work if the power unexpectedly gets cut
AES 256-bit hardware-based encryption keeps data safe and secure from hackers and thieves
Product ships in Amazon certified frustration free packaging (may differ from packaging depicted in product collateral)
Toshiba L200 2TB SATA Internal 2.5" HDD
General
Features Shock sensor, Native Command Queuing (NCQ), Advanced Format technology
Device Type Hard drive - internal
Form Factor 2.5"
Interface SATA 6Gb/s
Buffer Size 128 MB
Width 69.85 mm
Depth 100 mm
Height 9.5 mm
Weight 117 g
Capacity 2 TB
Performance
Average Latency 5.56 ms
Drive Transfer Rate 600 MBps (external)
Spindle Speed 5400 rpm
Reliability
MTBF 600,000 hours
Non-Recoverable Errors 1 per 10^14
Power
Power Consumption 1.65 Watt (read/write) ¦ 0.85 Watt (low power idle)
Miscellaneous
Compliant Standards RoHS
Package Type Bulk
Environmental Parameters
Shock Tolerance (operating) 400 g @ 2 ms half-sine pulse
Shock Tolerance (non-operating) 1000 g @ 2 ms half-sine pulse
Vibration Tolerance (operating) 1 g @ 5-500 Hz
Vibration Tolerance (non-operating) 5 g @ 5-500 Hz
Sound Emission 23 dBA
Min Operating Temperature 0 °C
Max Operating Temperature 65 °C
Expansion & Connectivity
Interfaces 1 x SATA 6 Gb/s
Compatible Bay 2.5"
Manufacturer Warranty
Service & Support Limited warranty - 3 years
I was expecting that SSD would be faster than HDD..but both appear to have transfer rates of around 600mb/s ???
Both use the sata interface at 6gb/s.
The Toshiba HDD has a reliability MTBF 600,000 hours and a 3 year guarantee. SSD is the new boy on the block and it is expensive with little history.
Crucial CT2000MX500SSD1Z 2000 GB 2.5 Inch 7 mm M x 500 SATA Solid State Drive with 9.5 mm Adapter
by Crucial
4.7 out of 5 stars 896 customer reviews
| 218 answered questions
RRP: £308.39
Price: £240.24 & FREE Delivery in the UK. Delivery Details
You Save: £68.15 (22%)
Note: This item is eligible for click and collect. Details
1 new from £240.24 1 used from £235.44
Capacity: 2 TB
Customer Package Type: Frustration-Free Packaging
Sequential reads/writes up to 560/510 MB/s and random reads/writes up to 95/90k on all file types
Accelerated by Micron 3D NAND technology
Integrated power loss immunity preserves all your saved work if the power unexpectedly gets cut
AES 256-bit hardware-based encryption keeps data safe and secure from hackers and thieves
Product ships in Amazon certified frustration free packaging (may differ from packaging depicted in product collateral)
Toshiba L200 2TB SATA Internal 2.5" HDD
General
Features Shock sensor, Native Command Queuing (NCQ), Advanced Format technology
Device Type Hard drive - internal
Form Factor 2.5"
Interface SATA 6Gb/s
Buffer Size 128 MB
Width 69.85 mm
Depth 100 mm
Height 9.5 mm
Weight 117 g
Capacity 2 TB
Performance
Average Latency 5.56 ms
Drive Transfer Rate 600 MBps (external)
Spindle Speed 5400 rpm
Reliability
MTBF 600,000 hours
Non-Recoverable Errors 1 per 10^14
Power
Power Consumption 1.65 Watt (read/write) ¦ 0.85 Watt (low power idle)
Miscellaneous
Compliant Standards RoHS
Package Type Bulk
Environmental Parameters
Shock Tolerance (operating) 400 g @ 2 ms half-sine pulse
Shock Tolerance (non-operating) 1000 g @ 2 ms half-sine pulse
Vibration Tolerance (operating) 1 g @ 5-500 Hz
Vibration Tolerance (non-operating) 5 g @ 5-500 Hz
Sound Emission 23 dBA
Min Operating Temperature 0 °C
Max Operating Temperature 65 °C
Expansion & Connectivity
Interfaces 1 x SATA 6 Gb/s
Compatible Bay 2.5"
Manufacturer Warranty
Service & Support Limited warranty - 3 years
I was expecting that SSD would be faster than HDD..but both appear to have transfer rates of around 600mb/s ???
Both use the sata interface at 6gb/s.
The Toshiba HDD has a reliability MTBF 600,000 hours and a 3 year guarantee. SSD is the new boy on the block and it is expensive with little history.
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 8:29 pm
VDJ Ron
Quote
t almost goes without saying that copying files is infinitely quicker with an SSD. Of laptops we reviewed in the past 12 months, models with SSDs copied files at an average rate of 237.8 megabytes per second, while those with hard drives averaged just 33.9 MBps.
That's a big claimed difference. Is HDD spin up time involved in the tests?
My HDD perform much better with the power management disabled. Things related to VDJ often seem instant.
I don't need anymore speed than I have using HDD because my songs load rapidly..but I am interested in SSD.
t almost goes without saying that copying files is infinitely quicker with an SSD. Of laptops we reviewed in the past 12 months, models with SSDs copied files at an average rate of 237.8 megabytes per second, while those with hard drives averaged just 33.9 MBps.
That's a big claimed difference. Is HDD spin up time involved in the tests?
My HDD perform much better with the power management disabled. Things related to VDJ often seem instant.
I don't need anymore speed than I have using HDD because my songs load rapidly..but I am interested in SSD.
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 8:52 pm
VDJ Ron
I want you to add facts..so is the spin up time taken into consideration?
My HDD are slow if the disk has to spin up when using VDJ. However if the power management is disabled then my HDD are quite fast and subject to less wear due to less stopping and starting.
What does this mean for the Toshiba HDD drive "Drive Transfer Rate 600 MBps (external)"
Hm.. I suppose it could be max speed when the HDD reading/writing head just happens to be in the correct position..and not requiring time to move. I suppose that's why HDD need a defrag.
Note: In both cases the sata interface operates at a max. 6gb/s ???
I'm of course expecting the expensive SSD to be faster..but by how much?
My HDD are slow if the disk has to spin up when using VDJ. However if the power management is disabled then my HDD are quite fast and subject to less wear due to less stopping and starting.
What does this mean for the Toshiba HDD drive "Drive Transfer Rate 600 MBps (external)"
Hm.. I suppose it could be max speed when the HDD reading/writing head just happens to be in the correct position..and not requiring time to move. I suppose that's why HDD need a defrag.
Note: In both cases the sata interface operates at a max. 6gb/s ???
I'm of course expecting the expensive SSD to be faster..but by how much?
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 9:12 pm
VDJ Ron
The other thread is nothing to do with SSD.
I know you tried to make it so..but I had 4 x 2TB hdd drives to configure and your comments did not help.
This is the place to highlight the differences between the two types of drive.
I know you tried to make it so..but I had 4 x 2TB hdd drives to configure and your comments did not help.
This is the place to highlight the differences between the two types of drive.
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 9:57 pm
VDJ Ron
There is another thing..large capacity SSD are still quite rare. So we have all been reasonably happy using HDD more or less until this moment in time...but now they are too slow? That does not really make sense. If they do the job, which they do and have done for a long time, then that is all that should be required, at least for the time being.
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 10:28 pm
the SOUND INSURGENT
I’m not sure where your looking but here’s a lot of 4tb SSD’s
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.newegg.com/amp/productlist%3fkeyword=4tb%2bssd
And just so I’m clear, there’s nothing wrong with mechanical drives but the fact that they have “moving” parts makes them pron to failure....... We as djs don’t need those failures.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.newegg.com/amp/productlist%3fkeyword=4tb%2bssd
And just so I’m clear, there’s nothing wrong with mechanical drives but the fact that they have “moving” parts makes them pron to failure....... We as djs don’t need those failures.
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 10:41 pm
VDJ Ron
Toshiba HDD
Reliability MTBF 600,000 hours. 3 year guarantee.
Spin up/down does lower the reliability data.
I cannot remember my last HDD failure.
I wonder how long the guarantee is on SSD?
This is nice..but look at the price.
SAMSUNG 860 Pro Series 2.5" 4TB SATA III 3D NAND Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) MZ-76P4T0BW
£767.99
I know SSD is the future but they still have to make them cheaper.
This looks good for SSD
https://www.samsung.com/semiconductor/minisite/ssd/support/warranty/
Reliability MTBF 600,000 hours. 3 year guarantee.
Spin up/down does lower the reliability data.
I cannot remember my last HDD failure.
I wonder how long the guarantee is on SSD?
This is nice..but look at the price.
SAMSUNG 860 Pro Series 2.5" 4TB SATA III 3D NAND Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) MZ-76P4T0BW
£767.99
I know SSD is the future but they still have to make them cheaper.
This looks good for SSD
https://www.samsung.com/semiconductor/minisite/ssd/support/warranty/
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 10:53 pm
Don Moir
Ron are you just becoming aware of spin up/down issues?
geposted Fri 22 Feb 19 @ 11:42 pm
VDJ Ron
It's the first time I've been troubled. I normally use one large HDD. I knew they spun up/down but my secondary 1Tb Hitachi laptop drive which replaced my dvd drive was silly.. when not in use it spun down after about 10 seconds. I noticed the change of noise. For the first time VDJ was being affected, the songs loaded slowly from that drive as did tag data when the drive had to spin up. This was a new problem for me and the Win 10 power management for HDD did not seem to apply to my secondary drive, although the primary drive was fine.
The 1TB Hitachi hdd has now been replaced by a new 2Tb Seagate and it's running as well as my primary drive..which is easily good enough for my work.
I've downloaded 15,000 videos from VJ Pro in the last 5 months, a lot at 1080p and this has demanded much greater HDD capacity. VJ Pro has provided an excellent service which I wholeheartedly recommend.
The 1TB Hitachi hdd has now been replaced by a new 2Tb Seagate and it's running as well as my primary drive..which is easily good enough for my work.
I've downloaded 15,000 videos from VJ Pro in the last 5 months, a lot at 1080p and this has demanded much greater HDD capacity. VJ Pro has provided an excellent service which I wholeheartedly recommend.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 12:06 am
serieB
Despite the speed argument I always remember what a friend of mine, engineer in a rescue data center, always says about this solid vs mechanical debate: "SSD for processing and HDD for storaging".
SSD is faster but is like a big pendrive so can have issues with high temperatures, massive write operations and power cuts. So SSD for the OS and the apps but just now HDD for the data (songs or videos in our case) looks like the way to go.
SSD is faster but is like a big pendrive so can have issues with high temperatures, massive write operations and power cuts. So SSD for the OS and the apps but just now HDD for the data (songs or videos in our case) looks like the way to go.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 12:20 am
Don Moir
VDJ Ron wrote :
For those who don't understand computers it's not age which is critical but the speed which can be estimated as a Benchmark.
spin up/down is an elementary thing to know if you've been around a computer any length of time.
VDJ Ron wrote :
A lot of new laptops are much slower than mine and I doubt many can match 4TB of internal HDD storage capacity.
You should always do your research and then you won't end up with something slower than Ron's machine.
VDJ Ron wrote :
I can afford multipe backups because I spend wisely.
I think that means patching an older laptop... That's ok if it works for you... To me, if you don't have much money to spend on a computer (and I don't these days), laptops are a way to spend more money to get less. My current computer is a collection of parts, some from old computers I don't through away, some refurbished, one shinny new GPU, and a new SSD drive. Will probably smoke most of the laptops you guys use and easy to fix or upgrade for less money. Some of the new laptops look smoking hot though and appear to be addressing some of the heat problems with newer GPUs etc... at a price....
I remember when hard drives first came out. We were using 360k and 720k floppy disc (and relatives). We got a whopping 5mb hard drive... WOW... Problem was they were very easily damaged... just a bump on computer could do it... damaged means it was no longer usable. head crashes were common... We did have to travel with these drives sometimes and we packed them very well and bought along lots of spares. Once they got past all that they became very reliable.
I have had one hhd drive go bad on me since those early years that I remember... It was about year and a half or two years ago. Got to see it happen first hand... no head crash and was a very gradually thing. Things started to take longer, nothing was complaining about anything... Hardly noticeable but over some period of time it started to get worse... I took the drive to have it tested and had failed several test. I mean how do you know when an hhd drive is going bad if it is not a sudden thing. If a really bad thing happens then you know right away since it flat out does not work anymore... Such a rare thing how you can you be an expert on it?
So I needed a new drive. I have plenty of drives from days gone by but these are lower capacity slower drives. I keep them though. I have high capacity hdd drives that contain most of my data. That data is also backed up off site. I needed a new primary drive. So went looking at local computer shop here and sort of reluctantly went with an ssd drive. My thinking was well let's see what it can do. Geeze man, boots in seconds and many other things easy to see. If you have one of each then it is easy to compare... ssd flat out winner in speed... While I know the specs of no moving parts etc... I remember the early days of hhd... The ssd drive has been quite a performer and flawless as far as I know. You know drives are probably screwing up all the time but you never know because of error correction. Which is probably why, with my hhd drive that went bad, it took so long for for it to become unusable. My best guess is that the error correction was taking longer and longer.
So how to you know when an hhd dirve might be going bad... apart from any bad sudden failure. As as I know there is not much you can do to know that. I don't think there is something that can detect wear and tear that is predicable. Some things can be detected though... like bad sectors etc. But you want to know that before it gets to that point.
Just a couple more things about SSD drives that are convincing me besides speed.
1) most of the SSD drives have built in AES hardware encryption... AES is the world wide government standard for encryption.
2) You can absolutely know when an SSD drive is going bad. This is a system that is built into SSD. I think maybe you have to run some special software to find this out, but would be really nice to see an alert that comes up letting me know... Maybe one does... I don't know.. maybe someone else knows.. so computer says: "Hey Don, your drive x appears to be wearing out, consider replacing it"... To me this is worth any extra money you might spend. Prices and density are getting closer.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 1:22 am
VDJ Ron
Don..
From the secondary hdd all we have to do is retrieve a small video file @100mb. Why would that demand blistering SSD speed?
Now true speed comes from the cpu. So suppose I want to analyse a group of songs..then my fast i7 quad core does 3 at a time. That's proper speed. It can multi task very well so playing videos and browsing the internet or whatever is no problem.
Also my i5 2.8Ghz is not bad.
I always take two laptops on an important job.
It might be nice to have a fast boot up which SSD does provide, and I think some might like to put their operating system on a SSD, but I'm still happy with HDD.
Your comprehension is faulty..I pointed out that I was aware of spin up/down but this was the first time it affected VDJ. Can you understand that?
From the secondary hdd all we have to do is retrieve a small video file @100mb. Why would that demand blistering SSD speed?
Now true speed comes from the cpu. So suppose I want to analyse a group of songs..then my fast i7 quad core does 3 at a time. That's proper speed. It can multi task very well so playing videos and browsing the internet or whatever is no problem.
Also my i5 2.8Ghz is not bad.
I always take two laptops on an important job.
It might be nice to have a fast boot up which SSD does provide, and I think some might like to put their operating system on a SSD, but I'm still happy with HDD.
Your comprehension is faulty..I pointed out that I was aware of spin up/down but this was the first time it affected VDJ. Can you understand that?
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 1:54 am
Don Moir
Dear Ron....
Did I say anything about loading videos on your secondary drive... Fact is I still keep all my good stuff on an hhd drive... That will change though.
I said I use the SSD drive as my primary drive... where the computer boots... and where I put most applications that I can easily replace. Yeah quite good and easily noticeable with almost instant boot times... and easily noticeable with many things... I am still in test mode for SSD but as I said above with points 1) and 2), it is convincing me more and more... especially 2).. and not just speed as you imply that is all I am saying... you see Ron... bogus
I say all things from experience with whatever and usually over years of it... That comes form being shy when I was young and knowing the facts to the best I can just works best for me... You say you don't know why that I think you might need to change... Did not say that... I said if it works for you then fine... If you do try it I am implying you might like it and then maybe you can also speak with experience instead of lack of. Was not trying to convince you of anything... duh
Thinking clearly Ron? Comprehension? really... So your an expert on what? It's ok to be ignorant... everyone is ignorant about something... ....pretending to know is something else... I know what I don't know... Do you?
Did I say anything about loading videos on your secondary drive... Fact is I still keep all my good stuff on an hhd drive... That will change though.
I said I use the SSD drive as my primary drive... where the computer boots... and where I put most applications that I can easily replace. Yeah quite good and easily noticeable with almost instant boot times... and easily noticeable with many things... I am still in test mode for SSD but as I said above with points 1) and 2), it is convincing me more and more... especially 2).. and not just speed as you imply that is all I am saying... you see Ron... bogus
I say all things from experience with whatever and usually over years of it... That comes form being shy when I was young and knowing the facts to the best I can just works best for me... You say you don't know why that I think you might need to change... Did not say that... I said if it works for you then fine... If you do try it I am implying you might like it and then maybe you can also speak with experience instead of lack of. Was not trying to convince you of anything... duh
Thinking clearly Ron? Comprehension? really... So your an expert on what? It's ok to be ignorant... everyone is ignorant about something... ....pretending to know is something else... I know what I don't know... Do you?
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 2:10 am
wildcountryclub
to prevent the HD from spinning down is easy enough - there's free programs for that even.
and to have the file load fast when the seconds count? and believe me when i say some of those files bigger than 100mb and those seconds count like priceless gems for some of us.
we mix on the fly - when we need that ONE bit of ONE song that we suddenly remember that would make that mix and that night perfect - we don't have time to wait for a file to load or for a drive to spin up so we can load it.
we can discount other bottlenecks sometimes...but waiting on a drive to spin up to get to it is not one of them i'd care to deal with.
and to have the file load fast when the seconds count? and believe me when i say some of those files bigger than 100mb and those seconds count like priceless gems for some of us.
we mix on the fly - when we need that ONE bit of ONE song that we suddenly remember that would make that mix and that night perfect - we don't have time to wait for a file to load or for a drive to spin up so we can load it.
we can discount other bottlenecks sometimes...but waiting on a drive to spin up to get to it is not one of them i'd care to deal with.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 2:18 am
VDJ Ron
There is no reason to wait for an hdd to spin up and I don't. Even though only a little of a song is loaded it can still be played..and a full load taking 1-2 sec is not a problem. So I am quick.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 2:26 am
Don Moir
VDJ Ron wrote :
There is no reason to wait for an hdd to spin up and I don't.
And you apparently just learned that after implying you know computers and also implying others were stupid.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 2:54 am
VDJ Ron
I think that I have made up my mind about SSD. They are good for putting the operating system on but for data storage they offer little and at four times the cost of a HDD are not economical.
HDD is fine for a data drive for the time being. Any speed advantage of SSD offers next to nothing when loading a music video. Reliability is likely to be a false claim to promote SSD.
HDD is fine for a data drive for the time being. Any speed advantage of SSD offers next to nothing when loading a music video. Reliability is likely to be a false claim to promote SSD.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 3:00 am
VDJ Ron
With respect to HDD failure prediction and determination the manufacturers more often than not provide good software to determine a drives condition.
Don's description of a failing HDD has not happened in my world.
Don's description of a failing HDD has not happened in my world.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 3:18 am
Adion
VDJ Ron wrote :
Reliability is likely to be a false claim to promote SSD.
Not really:
https://www.networkworld.com/article/2873551/data-center/debunking-ssd-myths.html
Quote :
Exhaustive studies have shown that SSDs have an annual failure rate of tenths of one percent, while the AFRs for HDDs can run as high as 4 to 6 percent.
So at least ten times more reliable.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 3:32 am
Don Moir
VDJ Ron wrote :
With respect to HDD failure prediction and determination the manufacturers more often than not provide good software to determine a drives condition.
Your source please. I don't really know from experience with that and just what I have read. I can detect bad sectors all day long but that may not predict a failing drive. Nothing warned me about it either... With SSD is appears completely feasible to be warned automatically ahead of time. With HDD what you gonna do.. Scan the whole drive and hope for the best... HDD drives usually have some bad sectors on them from the get go but don't know about the most current drives. I did have to write bad sectors to floppy disc in the early days. Only we could read it.. It could not be copied... It became our protection for the software. But I don't know what test would be needed to detect a hdd drive that is going bad... Once it is bad that is another thing... I want the thing to pop up and warn me about a problem before it gets to late.
source: Network world. This high reliability means SSDs provide consistence performance. The health of SSDs can be monitored and planned for. It’s this predictable reliability and the absence of mechanical parts that give SSDs a huge advantage over the unpredictable performance and high failure rate of HDDs.
VDJ Ron wrote :
Don's description of a failing HDD has not happened in my world.
So what... That is a recurring theme in these threads. Someone will report a problem and someone else will claim it does not happen to them implying it must be the other guys fault... ridiculous as there are usually many factors involved...
I said it happened to me and you can trust that since I don't make up stuff.... It happened once. I think that HDD have had a very good track record though at least for me.
geposted Sat 23 Feb 19 @ 4:09 am
